Forums: September 2010 Kickstart Forum Archive: blood work
Created on: 11/17/10 12:54 PM Views: 9179 Replies: 26
cch22 Joined: 09/08/10 Location: New York State Posts: 1001	blood work Posted Wednesday, November 17, 2010 at 12:54 PM Hi I get blood work done every 3 mos for high choresterol. It is a good time to get any other tests done since they are drawing blood anyway. Does anyone have any thoughts on what other tests I should get? I have heard iron and b-12. or cbc..complete blood count.. (not sure what that is) I usually get my c reative protein.. Anything due to eating vegan? Thank you!
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mollyhorn Joined: 03/03/10 Location: Fort Worth, TX Posts: 582	RE: blood work Posted Wednesday, November 17, 2010 at 1:15 PM A CBC (complete blood count) is really only necessary if you're at risk for immune system attack – for example, if you have a compromised immune system from Lupus, HIV, or a long-term infection. If you're in good health, you probably don't need it... unless you're just curious. In my case, my doc drew a CBC and it showed up really low, which led to months of expensive testing to show... NOTHING! Turns out, my white count is just *naturally* low. So... take that for what you will. The tests my doctor recommended for vegans and otherwise healthy people are: Fasting Blood Glucose Fasting Cholesterol (full lipid panel) Triglycerides B-12 Iron Calcium Vitamin D Plus anything related to your age and gender, such as estrogen level and TSH (thyroid stimulating hormone), if necessary. Molly Horn
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cch22 Joined: 09/08/10 Location: New York State Posts: 1001	RE: blood work Posted Wednesday, November 17, 2010 at 1:24 PM thanks molly..
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Susan Levin Joined: 12/26/09 Posts: 1212	RE: blood work Posted Wednesday, November 17, 2010 at 2:55 PM Make sure you express interest in stored values as opposed to just circulating values. This is important for iron and B12. Susan Levin, MS, RD PCRM Director of Nutrition Education
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Wild4Stars Joined: 12/27/09 Location: Florida Posts: 832	RE: blood work Posted Wednesday, November 17, 2010 at 3:25 PM Molly's list is very good. My last Dr visit I added B12 test, I was VERY low. Also added Vit D test and found that I was in the "barely acceptable" range. I discuss my diet and lifestyle with my Dr. Let her know if I have any concerns and then we determine what tests should be done. Last trip we pretty much covered everything. She felt being vegan we should do all the iron related tests, which came back perfect. Vikki ~ Wild4Stars@gmail.com
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theodore Joined: 09/16/10 Posts: 643	RE: blood work Posted Wednesday, November 17, 2010 at 7:39 PM You mean you guys actually tell your doctor that you're vegan ?? Why on earth would you do a thing like that. You should never tell your doctor you're vegan. This is practically rule number 1 of being vegan. If they ask you what you eat, just use vague terms like "curry with rice" or "homemade pie". Or give them the names of some ethnic dishes that they won't have a clue about. If they ask what's in the dish, just say you don't know because you ordered it in a restaurant and the menu was all in Chinese. If they ask which restaurant it was, just pick one that closed down recently. Really the only acceptable times to tell your doctor that you're vegan is if: a) You're about to marry them, or b) They've just examined you thoroughly and tell you that they've never seen anyone in such excellent health as you. But even then you're not totally safe, because as soon as you tell them, they'll most likely go back to the reports and say something like "actually, your iron count does look a little low, in fact, come to think of it, you've probably only got 2 weeks to live unless you start eating steak at every meal." Also bear in mind that all their calculations are based on the acceptable nutrient levels for meat-eaters. They don't realise that vegans have lower requirements of most nutrients because our bodies use them much more efficiently. Rant over. Theodore Never make assumptions. You'll end up being an A**, and the UMP will TION you. -- Coach Smiley -- Fresh Prince of Bel Air
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Wild4Stars Joined: 12/27/09 Location: Florida Posts: 832	RE: blood work Posted Wednesday, November 17, 2010 at 7:52 PM Theodore - You crack me up !! My doctor actually thinks it's great that I'm vegetarian and tells me that if all her patients were like me, she would be out of business!! I only recently went vegan, but she was ok with that. "If your annual lab keeps coming back the way it does, you are just fine." She says I have the blood pressure and cholesterol of a 16 year old (I'm 5. She was concerned about my B12 being low, but is totally on board with supplements, never mentioned changing my diet. In fact, she said that it is not that unusual for someone my age to have low B12, vegan or not. My husband's cardiologist gave him a copy of the cover of Dean Ornish's book and said "this is how you need to eat." Basically, very low fat vegetarian. There are doctors out there that support and even promote a plant based diet. If I were to ever go to a doctor that tried to dissuade me from a plant based diet, I would change doctors, PERIOD. Thanks for the giggle. Vikki ~ Wild4Stars@gmail.com
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Mariberry Joined: 01/02/10 Posts: 297	RE: blood work Posted Wednesday, November 17, 2010 at 7:53 PM @ Theodore: tres amusant, cherie! My doctor loves that I'm doing my ultra best to be vegan (I am not perfect: no "meat" but very occasionally cheese sneaks its way in, and I've had an organic egg or two...) My C-Reative Protein count on my last test was perfecto (previously in the danger zone...!!!) and I'm certain it has to do with less inflammation due to next to no animal products in my diet. My cholesteral is now in the normal range (although I do take a 2.5mg Crestor when I remember My A1C is a little high still but I honestly think my poor sleeping habits attribute to that. I'm at "that age" when insomnia is my nemesis. Overall, following this program has made my 3-month reports pride-worthy. I feel like framing them All we are saying is "Give Peas a Chance"
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mollyhorn Joined: 03/03/10 Location: Fort Worth, TX Posts: 582	RE: blood work Posted Wednesday, November 17, 2010 at 7:56 PM theodore wrote: You mean you guys actually tell your doctor that you're vegan ?? Why on earth would you do a thing like that. You should never tell your doctor you're vegan. This is practically rule number 1 of being vegan. ... b) They've just examined you thoroughly and tell you that they've never seen anyone in such excellent health as you. But even then you're not totally safe, because as soon as you tell them, they'll most likely go back to the reports and say something like "actually, your iron count does look a little low, in fact, come to think of it, you've probably only got 2 weeks to live unless you start eating steak at every meal." Also bear in mind that all their calculations are based on the acceptable nutrient levels for meat-eaters. They don't realise that vegans have lower requirements of most nutrients because our bodies use them much more efficiently. Hey Theodore, I totally understand where you're coming from, but I have to respectfully disagree. As someone who lives with chronic illness, I tell my doctor everything. And I think everyone should, not just those of us who are ill. It's the only way you're guaranteed to get good care. There was a recent (USA) poll of doctors asking what their top complaints about patients were, and one was "not being told enough information." Not kidding. How can a doctor diagnose your illness if you lie to him/her about your health status? To say "You should never tell your doctor you're vegan. This is practically rule number 1 of being vegan." is doing a disservice to vegans. You're encouraging us to be dishonest and to continue to purport the negative rumors that consistently dog vegans. Vegans don't need any more negativity around us than we already have – because we have plenty. We need people to use positive, optimistic tones when talking about veganism; to share their truthful experiences of good health. You mentioned that vegans have lower requirements of certain nutrients because "we use them more efficiently." As far as I know, this misinformation that has been spread as "truth" by certain fringe aspects of the vegan/raw food movement. None of the reputable vegan-oriented doctors I've studied have ever backed up this claim. Theodore, I have much respect for you and I know you're a very intelligent person. But I must disagree with you in this post – and ask that you please rethink your position on talking to doctors about veganism. Perhaps if more of us shared our vegan success stories with our doctors, then our doctors would be more encouraging of veganism. Molly Horn
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Mariberry Joined: 01/02/10 Posts: 297	RE: blood work Posted Wednesday, November 17, 2010 at 8:05 PM mollyhorn wrote: Hey Theodore, I totally understand where you're coming from, but I have to respectfully disagree. As someone who lives with chronic illness, I tell my doctor everything. And I think everyone should, not just those of us who are ill. Hi Molly - I think Theodore's post was tongue-in-cheek. I didn't take his post seriously. I did find it funny, as I feel that's how it was meant to be taken. Over to you, Theodore, to clear this up.... All we are saying is "Give Peas a Chance"
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Wild4Stars Joined: 12/27/09 Location: Florida Posts: 832	RE: blood work Posted Wednesday, November 17, 2010 at 8:09 PM I took Theordore's post as "tongue in cheek" and it cracked me up. I hear the frustration in his humor, but still, it is humor. Vikki ~ Wild4Stars@gmail.com
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theodore Joined: 09/16/10 Posts: 643	RE: blood work Posted Wednesday, November 17, 2010 at 11:16 PM . Never make assumptions. You'll end up being an A**, and the UMP will TION you. -- Coach Smiley -- Fresh Prince of Bel Air
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theodore Joined: 09/16/10 Posts: 643	RE: blood work Posted Wednesday, November 17, 2010 at 11:56 PM Molly I forgot to say, I'm sorry to hear about your illness. Have you tried any of the McDougall / Furhman / Hipocratees plans ?? Never make assumptions. You'll end up being an A**, and the UMP will TION you. -- Coach Smiley -- Fresh Prince of Bel Air
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mollyhorn Joined: 03/03/10 Location: Fort Worth, TX Posts: 582	RE: blood work Posted Wednesday, November 17, 2010 at 11:57 PM Oh, touché! You are right on about the DHA. Point taken. And you may be right that few people would take your advice... but one never knows. There are many naïve potential vegans and new vegans out there who are looking for guidance, and who are easily swayed by whatever information comes their way. That's the main reason I try so hard to give the most accurate information that I can – so that those who are new and who might potentially make the transition have the easiest time of it, and may therefore bring others with them. But I see your points, and I certainly don't want to argue with an accountant. That'll get me all tied up in knots... I never did well in math. Molly Horn
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mollyhorn Joined: 03/03/10 Location: Fort Worth, TX Posts: 582	RE: blood work Posted Thursday, November 18, 2010 at 12:03 AM theodore wrote: Molly I forgot to say, I'm sorry to hear about your illness. Have you tried any of the McDougall / Furhman / Hipocratees plans ?? Thank you for saying that, Theodore. That's sweet of you. To answer, yes and no. I'm sort of following the Furhman plan, but only very loosely (tons of veg, fruit, limited fat in whole food form, no added sugar, only whole grains). I recently purchased McDougall's book, but haven't read it yet, and I don't know anything about the Hippocrates institute, other than that it exists. My situation is multiple autoimmune diseases, which may or may not be responsive to diet. Some days are better than others, and a lot of it has to do, I think, with my own willingness to do what is required of me. There are many things I could be doing better, but haven't yet... I'm damned stubborn / unwilling / insane. Molly Horn
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mollyhorn Joined: 03/03/10 Location: Fort Worth, TX Posts: 582	RE: blood work Posted Thursday, November 18, 2010 at 12:58 AM Ooh, clarification on the DHA issue from Ginny Messina. Looks like it isn't so great for us after all: http://www.theveganrd.com/2010/11/do-vegans-need-supplements-of-omega-3-fats.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheVeganDietitian+%28The+Vegan+Dietitian%29 Turns out there were only 5 vegan women in that study, and they had varying levels of DHA in their blood. So... guess we shouldn't start celebrating – not yet, anyway. Molly Horn
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theodore Joined: 09/16/10 Posts: 643	RE: blood work Posted Thursday, November 18, 2010 at 1:10 AM . Never make assumptions. You'll end up being an A**, and the UMP will TION you. -- Coach Smiley -- Fresh Prince of Bel Air
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Bugsmom Joined: 09/13/10 Posts: 2087	RE: blood work Posted Friday, November 19, 2010 at 8:52 AM We do tell our dr about dietary things since HE was the one who suggested the DASH program for hubby's hypertension before prescribing any medications. Alas, heredity also plays into that so hubby is now on medication for that and cholesterol levels (despite little to no animal consumption and reasonable exercise, his cholesterol levels are still upside down, just like his dad's and his grandfather's). The doctor is quite impressed at the weight we've both lost over the last few years (and the 6 lbs I've droppped since my last 3 month follow up - which was just prior to the Sept kickstart). And, since I'm a type 2 diabetic, diet is a prime topic of conversation. Last week, our 12 yr old son had his annual checkup and they did a quick finger stick iron test. Came out just fine even though there's no meat or supplements in him - just lots of good green leafies and beans and legumes and such. --Deb R
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mommyof2nc Joined: 12/31/09 Location: North Carolina Posts: 172	RE: blood work Posted Friday, November 19, 2010 at 11:18 AM I tell my doctor about my dietary choices, too, and I'm glad I did. He first asked me about them when I went in for a 6 months cholesterol check and my total cholesterol when from 213 to 152, due to the vegan diet. Once I told him about switching to the vegan diet, he told me that he's a vegetarian, too, and that I should stick to it, as it's the healthiest way to eat. Something I didn't ask him, however, was why he never mentioned this before I came to that conclusion on my own. I suspect it's because we live in a very conservative county and most of his patients would think he was a whacko if he recommended that type of diet to them. I know I get a lot of weird looks and comments when it comes out that I don't eat animal products, so just imagine what would happen if his choices came out, too.
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mommyof2nc Joined: 12/31/09 Location: North Carolina Posts: 172	RE: blood work Posted Friday, November 19, 2010 at 11:19 AM Please excuse my typos - I tried editing my original post but it wouldn't let me for some reason.
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