Forums: September 2010 Kickstart Forum Archive: What Every Meat Eater Should Know About Vit B12
Created on: 11/20/10 05:21 PM Views: 1859 Replies: 4
theodore Joined: 09/16/10 Posts: 641	What Every Meat Eater Should Know About Vit B12 Posted Saturday, November 20, 2010 at 5:21 PM Dear All After reading a message on an internet forum (I don't remember the name of it) I did some research, and came acrross the following article: http://download.journals.elsevierhealth.com/pdfs/journals/0022-0302/PIIS0022030245951769.pdf For those of you who can't be bothered to read it, the article basically provides evidence that, due to cobalt deficiency in the soil, more and more farm animals are being diagnosed with cobalt deficiency, which in turn leads directly to B12 deficiency, as cobalt is essential for the formation of B12 in ruminants. As a result, cobalt supplementation (which is effectively B12 supplementation) is quite common in livestock farming. Cobalt deficiency can also occur in farm animals in such circumstances when their cobalt intake is sufficient but they are exposed to nitrous oxide (either from automobile emmissions or from the application of synthetic nitrogen fertiliser in agriculture). So it appears that vegans aren't the only ones taking B12 supplements. Meat eaters are often taking them without knowing it, because the animal has already taken the supplement on their behalf. And that doesn't even take into account all the meat eaters who need to take B12 supplements even after consuming large amounts of animal products in their diet. I'm uncertain whether the cause of B12 deficiency in farm animals (namely cobalt deficiency in the soil and / or exposure to nitrous oxide from automobile and agriculture emissions), is the same cause of B12 deficiency in vegan humans. It would be interesting to know if any research has been done on that theory. Theodore Never make assumptions. You'll end up being an A**, and the UMP will TION you. -- Coach Smiley -- Fresh Prince of Bel Air
	Edited 11/20/10 6:14 PM Quote | Send PM | Link | Top | Bottom
Lauren1213 Joined: 09/06/10 Location: Florida Posts: 57	RE: Vit B12 Posted Saturday, November 20, 2010 at 5:31 PM Thank you Theodore for that link and very informative information. My husband and I realized relatively early into eating vegan that we were beginning to show some symptoms of B12 deficiency, so we are now supplimenting. Take care, Lauren
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theodore Joined: 09/16/10 Posts: 641	What Every Meat Eater Should Know About Vit B12 Posted Sunday, November 21, 2010 at 7:33 AM Your welcome Lauren. P.S. - I forgot to mention that another major source of nitrous oxide exposure for humans is dentists' anaesthetics (and hospital anaesthetics to some extent). Apparently antibiotics also have a deleterious effect on B12 absorption, and it has been suggested that vegetables with antibiotic properties may have a similar effect. But please don't interpret these posts as a suggestion to stop taking B12 supplements. If anything I'm suggesting why in this day and age, it's important that we do take them. But I'm also making the point that: a) meat eaters are perhaps just as dependant on B12/cobalt supplementation as we are, if not more so. and b) it would be interesting to know whether any of the research that's been done on B12 deficiency in vegans has taken into account factors such as: 1) - Cobalt levels in the soil. 2) - Exposure to nitrous oxide (via nitrogen fertilisers, automobile pollution, anaesthetics etc.) 3) - Exposure to antibiotics. 4) - The consumption of vegetables with antibiotic properties (many of which happen to be forbidden in the Eastern religions). After all, some studies have shown that we produce B12 all through our bodies (as high up as the oesophagus), in which case the main issues would appear to be a possible cobalt deficiency in the diet and / or that something (perhaps one of the things listed above) is impairing our absorption of B12 once our body has produced it. As such, the quest for an external source of B12 would appear to be a misdirection. Yours Theodore Never make assumptions. You'll end up being an A**, and the UMP will TION you. -- Coach Smiley -- Fresh Prince of Bel Air
	Edited 11/21/10 7:49 AM Quote | Send PM | Link | Top | Bottom
Bugsmom Joined: 09/13/10 Posts: 2072	RE: What Every Meat Eater ...Vit B12 Posted Monday, November 29, 2010 at 4:35 PM You've got me curious - which veggies have antibiotic properties? Are we talking about things like garlic? What else would be on the list? --Deb R
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theodore Joined: 09/16/10 Posts: 641	What Every Meat Eater Should Know About Vit B12 Posted Monday, November 29, 2010 at 5:44 PM Thanks for your query Bugsmom. Antibiotic vegetables would be onions, garlic, radishes and, I believe, mustard oil. There may be others I'm not aware of. If memory serves, such vegetables loose their AB properties once they've been cooked though. In which case I guess they would have less of an effect on one's intestinal flora. Of course, I have no idea whether even raw AB vegetables have any effect on intestinal flora. That particular suggestion is one that has been put forward by the Natural Hygiene movement. Never make assumptions. You'll end up being an A**, and the UMP will TION you. -- Coach Smiley -- Fresh Prince of Bel Air
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