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| Forums: September 2010 Kickstart Forum Archive: Blood glucose levels still too high | |||
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| rlumley
Joined: 09/23/10 Posts: 5 |
Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Thursday, September 23, 2010 at 11:39 AM I actually started Dr. Barnard's vegan diet on 8/17 following the meals very closely. I'm a type 2 diabetic and prior to starting the diet my glucose levels have been maintained by medication (januvia and metformin) in the range of 120 - 140. After starting Dr. Barnards diet, my glucose range has shifted up to 140-170. I exercise by brisk walking 2-2.5 miles per day. My physician recommends the ADA diet which I have tried without much impact. I enjoy the vegan diet very much and have lost 10 pounds since beginning in August (20 more pounds to go) I recall reading that blood glucose readings can initially rise but I'm wondering whether after a month I should see improvement. I have an appointment with an endocrinologist in mid october who is familiar with Dr. Barnard's diet. Are the sustained higher readings normal? Or should I further alter my diet. I'm sure my fat levels are down to the 10% level as I watch that quite closely. I do eat a fair amount of fresh fruit. |
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| changing
Joined: 09/09/10 Posts: 22 |
RE: Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Thursday, September 23, 2010 at 12:16 PM I would suggest that you start a food journal, and increase the frequency of blood glucose testing so that you can identify which foods/amounts are not working for you. Also, learn all you can about the glycemic index and choose only low GI foods. If you're still having problems after a few weeks, consider meeting with a nutritionist, and bring your food/blood sugar journal with you. |
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| ctrapp
Joined: 09/23/10 Posts: 1 |
RE: Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Thursday, September 23, 2010 at 12:27 PM Congratulations on the 10lb weight loss. This is generally very good for blood sugar control, and is also good for your body in ways that can't be so easily measured. A small number of people do initially see their blood sugars rise when they switch to a low-fat, plant based diet, and I do occasionally see this in my clinical practice. Almost always, over time, the numbers do get better. It may take more time for some bodies to shift to efficiently processing the additional healthful carbohydrates. One possible explanation for this is described starting on page 22 of the book, Dr. Neal Barnard's Program for Reversing Diabetes, where he discusses Intrmyocellular Lipids. I would suggest sticking with the diet and not obsessing too much about the blood sugar numbers for right now - we know that people who follow a vegan diet have less heart disease and live longer, and that is ultimately what you want to acheive. Your health care provider can help you determine how long it is safe for you to run the slightly higher (140-170) numbers you have been seeing. Did you stop your medication? It was not clear from your letter. That may also explain the higher readings while you are new to a plant-based diet. Finally, you mentioned you are eating a lot of fruit. Some people are especially sensitive to the sugar in fruit, and for now, you may want to keep fruit intake to 2 servings a day, and fill up on unlimited vegetables, whole grains and legumes. It will be interesting to see if that makes a difference over the course of a week or two. Finally, an aside. Let me take this opportunity to remind everyone that metformin (Glucophage) can cause low vitamin B12 levels. A vegan diet can also cause low B12 (as can an unhealthy omnivore diet and normal aging). Low B12 has been associated with neurological problems, and uncontrolled diabetes is also associated with neurological problems, so there is a triple risk. THEREFORE, if you are on metformin, have your B12 levels checked periodically. Ditto for those on a vegan diet long term (it takes several years to use up the body's store of B12, but unless you know if you currently have enough stored, assume you need some). A basic multivitamin has all the B12 you need. Keep us posted on your progress with your blood sugars. Everyone here is rooting for you! Caroline Trapp, MSN, APRN, BC-ADM, CDE |
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| rlumley
Joined: 09/23/10 Posts: 5 |
RE: Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Thursday, September 23, 2010 at 12:29 PM Thanks for the response. I really do focus on low GI foods as this has always been important with my diabetes and emphasized by Dr Barnard's recommendations. I will start keeping a food journal and try to correlate more closely with my glucose readings. |
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| rlumley
Joined: 09/23/10 Posts: 5 |
RE: Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Thursday, September 23, 2010 at 12:36 PM Thank you Caroline for the response. I have not stopped any medications. I will also keep a food log and more frequent glucose readings as suggested by Changing. Unfortunately the endocrinologist I want to see has a very full schedule so I won't be checking in with him until mid-november. He is with the university hospital and I'd like to wait for his guidance before seeing a nutritionist. |
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| Bugsmom
Joined: 09/13/10 Posts: 2087 |
RE: Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Thursday, September 23, 2010 at 12:58 PM One thing to consider too is which grains and veggies you are eating. For instance, I know some folks who cannot eat rice at all (not even brown rice) or it raises their glucose levels. However, they can eat potatoes (small red potatoes for instance) but I just can't without my glucose jumping. Some folks can't tolerate cold cereal without a spike, other folks (like me) can if I choose carefully which ones I eat. Another one that really messes with me is oranges - I can eat apples, pears, some melons, and so on no problem but an orange (whole, not juiced) will throw me out of whack. Some people can't eat apples without getting off track. I agree that a food journal is probably a good idea. There may be some food or foods that you weren't eating much of (if at all) that you are now eating that aren't agreeing with your blood sugar metabolism. You need to know which foods, healthy and vegan though they may be, just aren't the best fit for your unique self. |
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| rlumley
Joined: 09/23/10 Posts: 5 |
RE: Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Thursday, September 23, 2010 at 1:35 PM Thanks, bugsmom. The elevated blood glucose readings are not spikes. I usually take a reading before meals. My diet is not really concentrated in any one type of food from the 21 Day Kickstart. My wife has really gotten into vegan cooking so I would say rice is rare and potatoes even rarer. |
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| Teddi
Joined: 09/09/10 Posts: 2 |
RE: Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Friday, September 24, 2010 at 9:10 AM I started the vegan diet the second week of July and this past week is the first week I have seen my blood sugar levels down by 20 points. It took me two months to see a decrease in my blood sugar levels so hopefully you will see a change soon. |
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| bsusan409
Joined: 09/24/10 Posts: 1 |
RE: Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Friday, September 24, 2010 at 10:11 AM Have you removed peanut butter, any nuts, olive oil and avocados, by chance? People are very surprised when they hear this but it does follow Dr. Barnards theory explained well in his "Revere Diabetes" book This has worked wonders for me as well as the vegan diet. Are you using only plant based milks like rice milk that have zero cholesterol? |
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| rlumley
Joined: 09/23/10 Posts: 5 |
RE: Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Friday, September 24, 2010 at 8:25 PM Thank you for the additional comments. I'm really sticking with Dr. Barnards meal plan so peanut butter, nuts and avocados have been out since starting the diet. Teddi your information is very helpful as I had no idea whether to expect improved glucose metrics after a few days. I don't know if I'm seeing an anomaly but my readings last night and this morning were 118 and this afternoon 134. Regardless of how fast I see real change, I like this diet and already feel healthier. |
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| garys
Joined: 01/08/11 Location: Sacramento,Ca Posts: 1 |
RE: Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Saturday, January 8, 2011 at 8:10 PM I joined the program 1/3/2011 and I'm a type 2 diabetic. My glucose levels have gone up. My morning level was 80-110 and evening was around 120. Now my morning is at 185 and evening is running about 226. None of the doctors I have know about this program. My endocrinologist started me on Byetta 1.5 years ago. This got me off the insulin because I lost 39 pounds but nothing since. I want off all of the drugs so I started the program. But if my glucose level does not go back down I may be back on insulin which just adds weight back on. I saw the chat about rlumley's blood levels. What did the doctors say rlumley when you went back in October? Any one else have any suggestions? |
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| Checochinican
Joined: 01/04/11 Posts: 148 |
RE: Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Sunday, January 9, 2011 at 10:01 AM Stepping in here to comment - it took my body about 12 days to adjust to the new vegan diet, but after that my glucose levels rapidly fell into a normal range. At first, they went up. I had been following a very low carbohydrate diet, so I expected an increase for a while. |
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| Bugsmom
Joined: 09/13/10 Posts: 2087 |
RE: Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Wednesday, January 12, 2011 at 8:43 AM garys wrote: I joined the program 1/3/2011 and I'm a type 2 diabetic. My glucose levels have gone up. My morning level was 80-110 and evening was around 120. Now my morning is at 185 and evening is running about 226. None of the doctors I have know about this program. My endocrinologist started me on Byetta 1.5 years ago. This got me off the insulin because I lost 39 pounds but nothing since. I want off all of the drugs so I started the program. But if my glucose level does not go back down I may be back on insulin which just adds weight back on. I saw the chat about rlumley's blood levels. What did the doctors say rlumley when you went back in October? Any one else have any suggestions? Also, keep an eye on what you're eating - it's possible to eat too much of a good thing. Your meter is your friend, as you already know. You may find that brown rice is not good for you, so sub quinoa or other grain when recipes call for it. And so on. I know, for instance, that one slice of vegan quiche is fine but two is too many (big difference in blood glucose reading). Still vegan, still fairly low fat and low glycemic (uses navy beans instead of eggs so plenty of protein and fiber and a whole wheat crust, no hydrogenated fat) but two is just too many. --Deb R |
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| diabetesdiva
Joined: 01/16/11 Posts: 1 |
RE: Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Sunday, January 16, 2011 at 7:57 AM Good for you to be so in tune with your #s! You may consider a diabetes journal (which includes the food journal). I agree about sharing this information and consulting with a Nutritionist and/or Certified Diabetes Educator. If you think about all the things that can impact blood sugar levels, there are a lot: timing of medication, stress (emotional, infections, cold/cough, etc), activity level, etc. can all change/impact blood sugar levels. I also find paired testing helpful - check BG before you eat and 2 hours after you start eating your meal (you can set a reminder on some BG meters or use a clock, friend/family to remind you). Ultimate goals are for a blood sugar 80-120 premeal and i less than 150 at the 2 hour mark. Good Luck! |
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| kristine13826
Joined: 01/18/11 Posts: 14 |
RE: Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Tuesday, January 18, 2011 at 9:33 AM I found out that eating mostly greens and salads and veggies are your best bet.THOSE are the freebies or freestyle eating for. But ANY kind of carb you will still have to count awhile like having just a of 1/2 a cup or 1/3 of a cup of ANY rice, pasta, potato~~ even if it IS whole grain you will STILL have to do the counts . Although as your body gets better it may just be you will later be able to stop counting carbs. I just love the foodlovers diet saying where he says if it ain't meat it's a carb! Knowing that, just fill your plate with the stringent stuff like kale ,lettuce, collards, mustard greens, beet tops and all kinds of green salads like endive escarole frise mache' lambs quarters etc. All kinds of GREEN veggies broccoli, brussle sprouts, string beans etc. |
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| Checochinican
Joined: 01/04/11 Posts: 148 |
RE: Blood glucose levels still too high Posted Tuesday, January 18, 2011 at 11:43 AM kristine13826 wrote: just fill your plate with the stringent stuff like kale ,lettuce, collards, mustard greens, beet tops and all kinds of green salads like endive escarole frise mache' lambs quarters etc. All kinds of GREEN veggies broccoli, brussle sprouts, string beans etc. How much of that kind of stuff would one have to eat in order to maintain one's weight? Basically, we need calories, something on the order of 1200 to 2000 of them. I struggle with that all the time, the conflict between controlling my blood glucose with diet and stopping the weight loss that I've been experiencing on the vegan diet. |
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